So I find that the Family History Library in Salt Lake City, Utah has microfilmed the parish records from 1578 through 1792. They have the Civil Registration (remember Napoleon and the Revolution?) from 1822-1913. Even better they have a link attached to that record that takes you to the Archives.Siene-et-marne.fr where all of these Civil Registration microfilms have been digitized. They added the link to the archive on 8 April 2009.
I searched for any variant of Marie/Marian/Mary with a surname Moore born between 1822 & 1842...but I come up with nothing...There are two common names: Moreau and Morin which could be the original surname. No Barcy or DeBarcy surname at all.
I looked for the French variant of George and Sylvia at Behind the Name and came up with: Georges and Sylvie....there just aren't many variants. Marian, however, comes up with a ton...including Anne, Marianne, Marie, Manon, Ninon...Oh dear, didn't think it would be this difficult.
Maybe if we go page-by-page looking for a family that has a Georges, a Sylvie and a Mari-? we will have the right family.
Oh, and remember that story about the "escape from France, dressed as a nun"? My sister was looking at the history of France and found a second revolution in Paris, 1848. At 10-12 years old, this would be a little bit early for what I'd think she could pass as a nun. But three years later there was the Coup d'Etat of 2 December 1851. Maybe it wasn't a religious persecution at all.
Well, what now? All of these items are too coincidental for me to just throw them all out. There's something here that I need to know in order to find her. I just don't know what it is. What do you think?
Showing posts with label Moore. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Moore. Show all posts
Wednesday, July 8, 2009
Sunday, April 5, 2009
Was she really born in France?
Was Marian DeBarcy really born in France?
It is possible that the whole story is a hoax to cover the children's illegitimacy. In all the censuses Mary Ann Moore is born in Liverpool. But, looking up all the Mary Ann Moores of approximately the same age, born in Liverpool, listed in the 1851 and 1841 censuses doesn't show a family with Mary Ann, George & Sylvia as children's names. Maybe she borrowed a story from an ancestor?
Does she really have a brother, George and sister, Sylvia? George is a common name in Charles Taylor, Sr.'s family and so is Sophia, which is awfully close to Sylvia. Hmmm....
It is possible that the whole story is a hoax to cover the children's illegitimacy. In all the censuses Mary Ann Moore is born in Liverpool. But, looking up all the Mary Ann Moores of approximately the same age, born in Liverpool, listed in the 1851 and 1841 censuses doesn't show a family with Mary Ann, George & Sylvia as children's names. Maybe she borrowed a story from an ancestor?
Does she really have a brother, George and sister, Sylvia? George is a common name in Charles Taylor, Sr.'s family and so is Sophia, which is awfully close to Sylvia. Hmmm....
Wednesday, February 25, 2009
Taylor? Moore? DeBarcy?
Am I crazy? Every so often I wonder if I've jumped to a conclusion that makes these families tie together. Then I have to go through all of the information to validate my conclusion that they are one and the same. So here goes...
Charles Taylor, Jr. [We'll call him this, for clarity] was born 1868 in Liverpool, England and immigrated to the United States in 1885. Charles, Jr. left documents listing information about his family in England.
Charles Taylor, Sr. was a druggist. He did work at #10 Cleveland Sq. (1861, 1871) That building was originally owned by his father, then passed to his brother, Samuel who died 1875, directing that all his property be sold and the proceeds split between his inheritors. So it isn't surprising that in 1881, Charles Taylor Sr. is a retired druggist. #2 Brook Subery....turns out to be Tuebrook Suburb in Liverpool, but we haven't yet been able to locate a Clifton Villars address.
There is indeed a Mary born to Charles Sr. and a previous wife, a Mary Collis Taylor. (Christening, 1851) The christening record gives Mary Collis Taylor, daughter of Charles Taylor (druggist) & Anne Clarke [surnamed Morgan]. The 1851 census gives the three of them, Charles Taylor, druggist; wife Annie Clerk Taylor, & dau. Mary Collis Taylor. There cannot be a mistake.
After her mother's death Mary Collis lived with Sam Taylor (1861-Mary Collis Taylor, neice) and John Taylor, who was a surgeon (1871-Mary C. Taylor, neice) although he was living on Hope St instead of the Parliament St address that Charles Jr. gives.
A little off on the "Dr." Sam Taylor. He was never listed as a doctor. He was a Paint & Varnish Manufacturer & Land owner (does this refer to the Cleveland Square address that he received as inheritance from his father? Have no record of him living at Figueroa Street, either.
So Mary Collis Taylor clearly ties Charles Sr., John and Samuel together as brothers.
Now as to Charles Sr.'s second family--our family. We could never find them by the surname Taylor. They just didn't show up. It wasn't until my sister found their names on the ship's register that we found the surname of "Moore." When we then looked for them with the surname "Moore" we found everything we expected. Our copy of the 1861 census for #10 Cleveland Sq was a really bad copy. We thought we could read Mary A Moore, but we weren't sure until I recently got a cleaner copy. It was definitely, Charles Taylor, druggist 45y & Mary A Moore, servant 24y, but she was born in Liverpool, not France...hmmm....
1871 William Moore 55y chemist, born Wale, Lancashire; wife, Mary Ann 33y born Liverpool; William 11y scholar born Liverpool; George H. 9y scholar born Liverpool; Annie 6y scholar born Liverpool; Charles 3y born Liverpool
1881 Mary Ann More, 44y widow, Machinist born Liverpool; Charles 14y, scholar born Liverpool; Jane 8y, scholar born Liverpool
1881 Groman family on Great Howard St. Ann Moore 15y, servant, born Liverpool.
Marian (Mary) Taylor, most of the information Charles Jr gave we cannot yet validate. However, the fact that Marian was also known as Mary, validates the information that we have found listing her as Mary Ann Moore.
All of the kids: his numbers don't add up, but of the children we have been able to track down birth records for, he's right on except for one thing--the surname. We have Christening & Birth Registration for William. Christening for Annie. Birth Registration for George. Christening & Birth Registration for Charles. Unfortunately, nothing for Alice Jane (Jennie). All of these records give them the surname of "Moore." All of the places that he records them currently living in were correct prior to 1950 (with the surname of "Taylor" in the USA).
Oddball information is that, William, George & Charles Jr's birth registrations have no father listed. However, William's christening record lists Charles Sr. as a bookkeeper, Annie's christening record lists him, a "victualler" and Charles Jr's christening gives him as a druggist.
A couple of other pieces of information not listed on this document: Marian DeBarcy was 20 years younger than Charles Taylor. This is validated by the 1861, 1871 & 1881 censuses & both Mary Ann Moore's death certificate & Charles Taylor Sr's death certificate.
Mary Ann Moore who died in 31 Dec 1882 is the same Mary Ann Moore we've been tracking. Ages match, she is the "widow of Charles Moore, Druggist" and the informant is A. Moore, daughter, with a different address...this would have to be Annie who was a servant in another household.
Charles Taylor Sr. in 1881 is retired druggist born in Liverpool, with wife, Margaret & daughter Nellie, 1y. 1891 census give Charles Taylor Sr. as retired druggist born in Liverpool widowed with four children; Nellie 11y born Liverpool; Fredrick 8y born Walton on the Hill; Margaret 6y born Walton on the Hill; Esther 2y born Walton on the Hill
Charles Taylor Sr. dies 24 Oct 1895, retired chemist, Informant is N. Taylor, daughter with the same address as Charles. His Letters of Administration state the same death date and address and state that Mary Collis Dickins (there's that Collis middle name again!) wife of Edward Francis Dickins "the natural and lawful daughter, and only next of kin" recieved the entire estate. Okay, so the "only next of kin" is a little off, but it is clearly the same Charles Sr. If Mary Collis Taylor is his daughter from the first marriage. His death certificate informant is Nellie Taylor, daughter from the third marriage. We already know that Mary Collis Taylor is the half sister, Mary that Charles Jr. was mentioning.
Therefore, Charles Taylor Sr. druggist/chemist born 1815 married 1st Anne Clarke, their child: Mary Collis Taylor born 1846 who married 1880 Edward Francis Dickins. Charles Sr. married 2nd Mary Ann Moore (Marian DeBarcy), their children: William born 1860, George born 1862, Annie born 1865, Charles Jr. born 1868, & Alice Jane (Jennie) born 1875. Charles Sr. married 3rd Margaret (possibly Rooney), their children: Nellie born 1880, Fredrick born 1881, Margaret born 1885, & Esther born 1889.
One man, three marriages (relationships?), 10 kids. Taylor & Moore surnames.
I guess I'm not crazy...he was!
Charles Taylor, Jr. [We'll call him this, for clarity] was born 1868 in Liverpool, England and immigrated to the United States in 1885. Charles, Jr. left documents listing information about his family in England.
Charles Taylor, Sr. was a druggist. He did work at #10 Cleveland Sq. (1861, 1871) That building was originally owned by his father, then passed to his brother, Samuel who died 1875, directing that all his property be sold and the proceeds split between his inheritors. So it isn't surprising that in 1881, Charles Taylor Sr. is a retired druggist. #2 Brook Subery....turns out to be Tuebrook Suburb in Liverpool, but we haven't yet been able to locate a Clifton Villars address.
There is indeed a Mary born to Charles Sr. and a previous wife, a Mary Collis Taylor. (Christening, 1851) The christening record gives Mary Collis Taylor, daughter of Charles Taylor (druggist) & Anne Clarke [surnamed Morgan]. The 1851 census gives the three of them, Charles Taylor, druggist; wife Annie Clerk Taylor, & dau. Mary Collis Taylor. There cannot be a mistake.
After her mother's death Mary Collis lived with Sam Taylor (1861-Mary Collis Taylor, neice) and John Taylor, who was a surgeon (1871-Mary C. Taylor, neice) although he was living on Hope St instead of the Parliament St address that Charles Jr. gives.
A little off on the "Dr." Sam Taylor. He was never listed as a doctor. He was a Paint & Varnish Manufacturer & Land owner (does this refer to the Cleveland Square address that he received as inheritance from his father? Have no record of him living at Figueroa Street, either.
So Mary Collis Taylor clearly ties Charles Sr., John and Samuel together as brothers.
Now as to Charles Sr.'s second family--our family. We could never find them by the surname Taylor. They just didn't show up. It wasn't until my sister found their names on the ship's register that we found the surname of "Moore." When we then looked for them with the surname "Moore" we found everything we expected. Our copy of the 1861 census for #10 Cleveland Sq was a really bad copy. We thought we could read Mary A Moore, but we weren't sure until I recently got a cleaner copy. It was definitely, Charles Taylor, druggist 45y & Mary A Moore, servant 24y, but she was born in Liverpool, not France...hmmm....
1871 William Moore 55y chemist, born Wale, Lancashire; wife, Mary Ann 33y born Liverpool; William 11y scholar born Liverpool; George H. 9y scholar born Liverpool; Annie 6y scholar born Liverpool; Charles 3y born Liverpool
1881 Mary Ann More, 44y widow, Machinist born Liverpool; Charles 14y, scholar born Liverpool; Jane 8y, scholar born Liverpool
1881 Groman family on Great Howard St. Ann Moore 15y, servant, born Liverpool.
Marian (Mary) Taylor, most of the information Charles Jr gave we cannot yet validate. However, the fact that Marian was also known as Mary, validates the information that we have found listing her as Mary Ann Moore.
All of the kids: his numbers don't add up, but of the children we have been able to track down birth records for, he's right on except for one thing--the surname. We have Christening & Birth Registration for William. Christening for Annie. Birth Registration for George. Christening & Birth Registration for Charles. Unfortunately, nothing for Alice Jane (Jennie). All of these records give them the surname of "Moore." All of the places that he records them currently living in were correct prior to 1950 (with the surname of "Taylor" in the USA).
Oddball information is that, William, George & Charles Jr's birth registrations have no father listed. However, William's christening record lists Charles Sr. as a bookkeeper, Annie's christening record lists him, a "victualler" and Charles Jr's christening gives him as a druggist.
A couple of other pieces of information not listed on this document: Marian DeBarcy was 20 years younger than Charles Taylor. This is validated by the 1861, 1871 & 1881 censuses & both Mary Ann Moore's death certificate & Charles Taylor Sr's death certificate.
Mary Ann Moore who died in 31 Dec 1882 is the same Mary Ann Moore we've been tracking. Ages match, she is the "widow of Charles Moore, Druggist" and the informant is A. Moore, daughter, with a different address...this would have to be Annie who was a servant in another household.
Charles Taylor Sr. in 1881 is retired druggist born in Liverpool, with wife, Margaret & daughter Nellie, 1y. 1891 census give Charles Taylor Sr. as retired druggist born in Liverpool widowed with four children; Nellie 11y born Liverpool; Fredrick 8y born Walton on the Hill; Margaret 6y born Walton on the Hill; Esther 2y born Walton on the Hill
Charles Taylor Sr. dies 24 Oct 1895, retired chemist, Informant is N. Taylor, daughter with the same address as Charles. His Letters of Administration state the same death date and address and state that Mary Collis Dickins (there's that Collis middle name again!) wife of Edward Francis Dickins "the natural and lawful daughter, and only next of kin" recieved the entire estate. Okay, so the "only next of kin" is a little off, but it is clearly the same Charles Sr. If Mary Collis Taylor is his daughter from the first marriage. His death certificate informant is Nellie Taylor, daughter from the third marriage. We already know that Mary Collis Taylor is the half sister, Mary that Charles Jr. was mentioning.
Therefore, Charles Taylor Sr. druggist/chemist born 1815 married 1st Anne Clarke, their child: Mary Collis Taylor born 1846 who married 1880 Edward Francis Dickins. Charles Sr. married 2nd Mary Ann Moore (Marian DeBarcy), their children: William born 1860, George born 1862, Annie born 1865, Charles Jr. born 1868, & Alice Jane (Jennie) born 1875. Charles Sr. married 3rd Margaret (possibly Rooney), their children: Nellie born 1880, Fredrick born 1881, Margaret born 1885, & Esther born 1889.
One man, three marriages (relationships?), 10 kids. Taylor & Moore surnames.
I guess I'm not crazy...he was!
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